Early Achaemenid Persians

Hi

I'm putting together a 15mm Early Achaemenid Persian army for Impetus and having a bit of trouble understanding the army list (in Extra Impetus 4, list 9) and the amendments and clarifications in Advanced Impetus (version 1.7 September 2015) regarding Large Units T+T.

In the army list the Immortals and Sparabara are shown as large units of missile troops (T) but with the front units having Palvese (presumably meaning 'Pavise') and no missile weapon and only the second unit having Short Bow A. I do not have a problem with this representation of the historical units as such but Advanced Impetus (page IX) clearly states that large units entirely formed of shooters (T) must fire with the front unit and not the rear unit (New Rule). So I'm confused by the fact that according to the army list even thought both units are 'T' the front unit does not in fact have a missile weapon and in Advanced Impetus it is telling me that only the front unit can actually fire.

I realise that there was a rather long thread on this subject back in 2015 - (http://impetus.ativiforum.com/t427-early-achaemenid-persians-550-420-bc-questions) but after spending a couple of hours reading through the posts I came away with a headache and no further forward on how to represent these troops or how they were supposed to work in the rules:)

Some help to clear this up would be very welcome.

On a separate but linked point I have some figures from Magister Militum that are labeled as 'Immortals' but are armed with a spear and a bow (in a case) but with a 'violin' shaped shield rather than a pavise. Now I have seen figures like these in some sources but in the lmpetus army list the only Immortals listed have Pavise so I'm not sure where I can use these figures. Again grateful for any thoughts.

Cheers Paul

The weapon type has been moved to the front unit with the rear unit feeding into the front unit. A LU of T functions the same way other large units function. So imagine a LU of Sparabara armed with Short Bow A. It has a front and back unit of VBU4. All losses are accrued during the game are placed on the back unit. Assume that a LU of Sparabara has lost 3 VBU during the game. This loss is placed on the rear stand and the unit would still fire with VBU4 while in good order.

Hope this helps

Hi Gaius

Yes that helps a lot and makes things pretty simple.

Cheers Paul

Yes as GC explains it. It was an anomaly as this was the only LU at the time that had missile fire as a primary function.

How you represent them is interesting. Historically they fought ten ranks deep with only the front rank and possibly the rear with spears. The front rank has Spara (shields) too. If you want the full visual I would go for two bases each with 2 ranks. The front rank of the front base should be Spara and spear, the rest just archers. Looks pretty.

The "Violin" shield figures are taken from the Persepolis Frieze which is usually assumed to show the Apple Bearers (which can be analogous to Immortals but there is a whole argument to be had there) in their role as Palace Guards. A lot of figure manufacturers have repeated this as an "Immortal" but I would suggest this is more ceremonial rather than their battle dress. The general consensus is they fought exactly like Sparabara. I would only use the Violin guys either in your camp or as part of a command stand with a rather nice chariot mounted general.

Hi Cyrus

Many thanks for your thoughts. How you suggest to represent the Immortals makes perfect sense, I just need to get some figures to represent the front rank with pavices.

Cheers Paul

You can thank Cyrus Paul for holding firm on representing the large T units. In the end it was his ideas that got implemented and I think, in retrospect, it was the right call. This is an interesting and fun unit to have in an army list.

Yes we had quiet a long discussion over this issue. The change has fixed the problem making Sparabara true T units again....much closer representation for these guys.