Attaching Commanders to CL's

This has been the subject of some conversation here lately. I presumed this was only available to a few armies but going through the lists I'm surprised just how many do have the option of attaching leaders to CL units Some unlikely candidates (I would have thought ?) E,M and L Imperial Romans and some of the Italian Wars are examples.
Would be interested to hear what people think and if anyone has actually put a general in the saddle of a light cavalry unit

Hi Tarty

I have done this with Late Roman where there is an option to attach to the Roman LC with Javelin. Personally think it is more historical if could attach to the LC Huns as think they did use these as bodyguard troops.

I did this as wanted to avoid having the commander with the Roman foot in the games.

In the Italian Wars period there is an option in the Maximillian list to have a commander attached to a LC Crossbow Unit 3/1 - from reading I think this did happen - well it is mentioned in an Osprey book!

Cheers Jez

There are specific historical examples of leaders roaming with light horse as opposed to being ponderous heavily armoured crab canneries. Lodovico de Medici and his Bande Nere is probably the classic example.

Equally in Impetus it isn't so much a cludge as a necessary requirement to get VD splits between commands. Take for example the French lists in the Italian Wars section you mention Tartty.

I don't know why but the King and Household cavalry are worth 3VD.

Which is exactly the same as a rear unit of Pikemen.

Now, I may be seriously misreading history but I would have thought tat smashing the Household Cavalry was quite a bit more prestigious than roughing up half of a pike block full of commoners.

Particularly when the pike block must have at least 2 pike units in it so it's valued at 6 victory points compared to 3 for the cavalry.

And given we have to balance our commands based on victory points not points cost per unit then the slightly odd outcome that arises is that your peasant pikes who cost you 33 points are worth twice as many victory points as your Elite Noble Cavalry that cost you 41 points.

Somehow I can't see anyone other than direct relatives caring too much about dead pikemen, but the social order and fabric of society would be interesting if the elite of the nobility are destroyed.

So, in essence, I understand why CL are often used as the General, equally the downside is your General isn't helping your toughest troops and he is with a unit that makes him very vulnerable to loss.

I understand the numbers argument. Having a general attached to light cavalry is a risky business thought it would be counterintuitive for these guys ?

Interesting proposition, Lodovico.

Aside from being a very nasty piece of work, he did command the Bande Nere. But as a condottiero. I don't know anywhere that he commanded an army per se.

I am not having a go at you, GG, as I hope you know me a bit better than that. At the end of it, it is whatever you can live with, I suppose.

As for Wintercon, I had to make a call as it was starting to become a "thing".

No offence taken at all Sexy Rexy, the skin is much thicker than that!

As the team discussed last Friday, it seems odd that the thrid rank of Pikemen in an undisciplined Swiss block are worth as many victory points as the Emperor or King and Household Cavalry.

So be it, they are the rules, we need to abide by them.  But the consequence of that is that when we need to balance out VD between commands people will sometimes want to boost the VD of a unit to make a legal list in a manner that is entirely legal.

If we want to make changes then so be it, but consider VD as a whole, not just one specific instance of how it is utilised.

When the range of allowed VDs is 1, 2 or 3 there isn't a lot of flexibility.

Increasing the VD of generals units risks generating 'VD dumps' that are hard to break.

All (*) units become 3VD as it is - would it break the game to have them automatically increase to 4VD? I doubt it but is it necessary? Lose the general's unit and you have lost more than just the VD, you've lost the benefit of the general, his initiative, his control and influence.

Fiddling with the value and range of VDs is fiddling with the machine code of Impetus - it would require a lot of analysis before I'd be happy releasing revised code.

The Impetus universe is bound by the 17% rule (6 sides). 

I still hold that commanders should be rated differently (geometric in scale). Expert + commanders are way too cheap. But it is the universe in which we ply our trade so we adapt.

GG has run the VD 4+ argument by me. I am not totally convinced for the same reasons as Zippee. I would be prepared to experiment with it but that old 17% spread would make such units - interesting.

Surely that's the 16.6*% rule

Not a lot to disagree with otherwise

At this stage I'm not convinced it's worth worrying about - if we knew how it was proposed for Impetus II then it'd be worth a discussion.