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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Gaius Cassius on Tue Mar 01, 2016 11:01 pm

This has probably been answered before but we had a situation recently where a CM was in melee with an enemy infantry unit. The CM had support from a friendly FL unit. The melee was a draw and the CM made a compulsory retreat. What happens to the FL support unit? Does the FL also retreat from the melee disordered with the enemy infantry remaining pat (as it can't follow up a compulsory retreat.) Or does the FL remain in the melee subject to future rounds of combat (all things remaining the same) as the main unit?
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Granicus Gaugamela on Wed Mar 02, 2016 2:12 am

I don't have my stuff handy but I thought it had been changed to a "may" retreat for the CM vs Infantry?

Thus any CM retreat would be voluntary so the supporting FL stick in place.

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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Gaius Cassius on Wed Mar 02, 2016 3:31 am

"May" retreat is correct. Which would argue for one understanding. But, on the other hand, the main unit is retreating from the melee. The rules also say that when the main unit retreats any support units also retreat.

Just to be clear, I have no personal axe to grind in this question. I can see both arguments.
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Cyrus The Adequate on Wed Mar 02, 2016 1:43 pm

I think the second option is correct - the CM MAY choose to remain in contact but should they retreat then the retreat rules kick in and the supporting unit also retreats
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by dadiepiombo on Wed Mar 02, 2016 1:57 pm

as Cyrus said
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Gaius Cassius on Thu Mar 03, 2016 3:35 am

Thanks for the clarification.

As an aside, if we reversed the above scenario and the FL was the main unit in the melee and it was supported  by a CM against enemy infantry and the FL lost the melee and retreated what retreat move would the CM make? Would it be a regular 1d6 or would it be a compulsory retreat 5+1d6? Could the enemy infantry pursue in this scenario?
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Cyrus The Adequate on Thu Mar 03, 2016 9:01 am

Interesting

Easy bit first
Irrespective of how far the CM retreated I would say the opposition could follow up assuming they are normally allowed to do so.

The harder bit
I think the CM would retire the normal D6 rather than the 5+d6 as they only fought as supports rather than as the main opponent
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Gaius Cassius on Thu Mar 03, 2016 2:50 pm

I'm inclined to agree with your thinking Cyrus. These are the kinds of details I hope Lorenzo will include in Impetus 2.
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by starkadder on Fri Mar 04, 2016 4:55 am

I will have to file that interpretation away for our competitions. It's certain to come up at some stage.
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Tarty on Tue Mar 08, 2016 2:22 am

Yes will have to file that one away. As a side issue the retreat no longer disorders is that right ?

Advanced Impetus
"Amendment to paragraph 7.6.2
In the case of a draw against Infantry, the player controlling
any CM/CL/CGL Units involved in the melee can
choose to retreat by 5U+1d6 or remain in contact."

Just thought I'd bring it up as this has been asked just recently. Old rule says "....in disorder"
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Gaius Cassius on Tue Mar 08, 2016 2:48 am

We continue to play that CM/CL/CGL that make a compulsory retreat from a draw become disordered if they are not already. Interesting to see if this is correct.
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Cyrus The Adequate on Tue Mar 08, 2016 9:09 am

I would say yes, the new rule doesn't supersede the original totally, just adds an option to remain in contact, so if you choose to retreat as per the original rules you still become disordered (sadly for my Persians)
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Gaius Cassius on Tue Mar 08, 2016 1:39 pm

Good way of putting it Cyrus. The change in the rule requires clarification and a new term (compulsory retreats are no longer compulsory!)
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Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry Empty Re: Compulsory Retreat of CM/CL/CGL with Support Infantry

Post by Tarty on Tue Mar 08, 2016 9:29 pm

Ok good think we're in agreement it's just been overlooked in the amended version.
The new wording should be.

Advanced Impetus
Amendment to paragraph 7.6.2

"In the case of a draw against Infantry, the player controlling any CM/CL/CGL Units involved in the melee can choose to retreat by 5U+1d6 disordered or remain in contact."
Smile
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